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October 12 2011 @ 03:48 pm
Personhood Amendment 26  
Granted I know sooo many of you will disagree with this Amendment but I have read recently how this Amendment will make birth control illegal and miscarriages a prosecutable offense. I just wanted to state that you shouldn't believe everything Mississippi for Healthy Families is telling you. If you want to know the truth go to the sites that are pro. Read the Amendment. It isn't about stopping people from using birth control or having miscarriages.

This Amendment is trying to state that once a child is conceived by any means, it is a person. I believe this to be true. You don't have to agree with me but don't spread the scare tactic lies.

NO ONE in their right mind would try to prosecute a woman who has suffered a miscarriage. They suffer so much and I feel like this scare tactic is heartless in it's nature. Get you facts right.

Women Being Prosecuted After Miscarriages
This article was brought to my attention by a gal who is against this Amendment: Outcry in America as pregnant women who lose babies face murder charges.

Case #1: If you read the article this girl is being prosecuted because her substance abuse is likely the cause of her child's death. I'm am on the fence about this but at the same time it disgusts me when women drink, do drugs, or smoke while pregnant. I do think they are committing a crime. One my own sister is guilty of. These people who are against this worry about the cost of not killing babies but someone like my niece who was a drug baby has incurred tons of medical bills because her mother harmed her before she was even born.

Still, should the girl be prosecuted? Not sure about that but honestly if they can prove her baby died because of the drugs then technically she killed her child. Just because an addiction is a "sickness" doesn't mean you aren't responsible for your actions.

Case # 2: What about the woman who tried to commit suicide? She took rate poison. I believe she killed her child and should be held accountable. If you try to commit suicide and kill another person in the process, you will be charged, but because this child has yet to be born (another words, not given the chance to learn, grow and love) it isn't the same? How is that logical? We were all once those unborn babies. I was a person from the time I was conceived and until the day I die and I believe that about everyone.

Case #3: What about the woman who did nothing and is being charged? First, we don't know all facts in the case, but I'm going to assume what we read it the entirety of the situation. That DA should be ashamed. If this article is true that nothing that woman did is criminal. So she is the person to be behind. Having said taht I found this artivles online about this woman.

Enough meth for an adult woman would seriously harm or even kill a small baby. And if the article is believed she did supply a baby with that dosage.

It is funny that they use this as an example in the first article but don't state that she admitted that. And if they are lying then that is very sad but what if they aren't?

I tend to believe that looking at every miscarriage for a crime is rather disgusting, but in the cases of drug users and suicides I understand it. Besides a miscarriage is a natural reaction of the body when the baby isn't viable. Taking a substance that harms the baby is not the definition of a miscarriage.


Birth Control
What the public at large calls birth control is in jeopardy. But that would be the "birth control" pills that destroy the baby that was conceived. If you are taking something to prevent conception those are not even close to being at risk.

I know many of you won't like that but there is a difference. This amendment is opposing abortion in all forms not conception.

IVF
I don't know a lot about this subject but this is an article that was shared with me.
http://thedmonline.com/article/personhood-amendment-may-not-be-what-you-think
http://www.yeson26.net/amendment-26/
http://www.yeson26.net/latest-news/scare-tactics/




 
 
 
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Jill aka Jo: TVD: Carolinesireesanwar on October 13th, 2011 12:00 am (UTC)
I tend to agree with you on a very large majority of it. At the same time, I feel like if these young teenagers are responsible enough to have sex they are old enough to be prosecuted for something. I'd be less inclined to believe that of a 12-13 year old. I do get that teenagers do really stupid things but they have to learn there are consequences and going easy on an addict never does them any good.

Having said that, I do believe that her sentence is really out there. I tend to agree with what you said about her sentence.

As for the woman who took rat poison. That is a matter of suicide as well. But I do believe she killed that child and in a horrible fashion because that baby was born and suffered before dying.

As for the third woman in the article, it sounds like the DA is stupid.
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Jill aka Jo: TVD: Salvatore Brotherssireesanwar on October 13th, 2011 05:43 pm (UTC)
I did that the first time around.

Yes, I really don't agree with the father's being over 18 but then it has to do with circumstances. Honestly, I think we should do more to discourage teens from having sex. I mean they are passing laws for younger and younger kids. 12, 13. The aren't mature enough for sex. These kids don't always understand what will happen when they do things, sure. I think most people know taking drugs will harm an unborn baby.

If she is 15 and the father is 18 or more and she slept with him she made a choice. I don't believe she didn't know it was a possibility in this day and age. Was she mature enough to have sex in the first place? I don't think so but maturity and knowledge are different.

Yes, it is possible she was naive about sex but I have my doubts. It just seems unlikely that an addict would be that naive. I feel like people in the world of drugs tend to know this stuff very well.
Angelserenitysangel on October 13th, 2011 01:19 am (UTC)
Okay firstly totally and utterly cobsmacked about prosecuting someone for having a mis-carriage. If that miscarriage can't be helped, which it happens. I've got two dear friends who have lived clean, healthy lives but have had multiple miscarriages. Just genetics. You can't prosecute someone for that.

That said, I believe the woman in question should be held accountable for her part in the death of her baby. It's manslaughter or negligent homicide in my opinion. If it's proven beyond a shadow of a doubt, that is, that her substance abuse led directly to the death of her unborn child. But if it didn't and it was due to circumstances not linked to her abuse At all...Then no, I don't think she should be prosecuted. But the chances are high it did contribute...And absolutely addiction is a sickness but you still know right from wrong and are accountable for your actions.

Jill aka Jo: TVD: Vampire Damonsireesanwar on October 13th, 2011 05:31 pm (UTC)
Yes, I do think it is stupid if prosecuting for actually mis-carriages that can not be controlled. It is so sad. My aunt and a friend both lost babies late in their pregnancy. It sucks big time. And there is no way on this Earth they should be charged with anything.

I can't even believe that her substance abuse didn't contribute. I feel like so many people don't even understand substance abuse. When you see it or deal with it first hand then you know... you see how harmful it is. You see the children who survive those pregnancies being Mentally Challenged. Or you see them reaching a certain age and not progressing. I mean women aren't prosecuted for their role in that. I think the death of said child should be addressed. And I agree for something like negligent homicide or manslaughter.

As for the woman trying to kill herself. Maybe harsher punishment. I just don't know. The idea of what she did upsets me greatly.
Angelserenitysangel on October 14th, 2011 05:49 pm (UTC)
Agree with everything you said. Amen!
Mira -Blueberry Witch / human in Elf disguise..: a momentmiravisu on October 13th, 2011 09:45 am (UTC)
So, Mississippi for Healthy Families have intentionally angled the meaning of this amendment then? (I had never heard of this amendment before, but I know there can be "odd" laws in various states in the US)
Am I right in guessing they have religious and political ties? :/


*nods*
If one is old enough to have sex, and the consequences that follow.. then one is old enough to be responsible for them.

But I believe that overall the onset for puberty has started at a lower and lower age due to environmental issues and partly also because of better living conditions etc, and then it's no wonder the mental aspect has yet to catch up with the young girls (and boys). And I seem to recall there being reports of girls that haven't even started first class that have started puberty... and have to be medicated to delay or slow the process down.

Overall, education, sexual and other needs to be introduced earlier no doubt, to make these young persons aware of their actions and the consequences they have. Where did society and us parents/adults go wrong? Because one needs to address the cause of the problem, not just the punishment.

If a woman took a dangerous substance that caused a miscarriage, that is obviously a tragedy. And there should be consequences. Was it obvious drug abuse and/or a matter of not caring about being pregnant, or intentional due to other reasons? Then that woman indeed shouldn't be pregnant nor be the one caring for a child regardless. And I do agree a life sentence is not something that she or society gains from. It's only negative reinforcement.
Jill aka Jo: Fringe: Peter Bishopsireesanwar on October 13th, 2011 05:56 pm (UTC)
Who has religious or political ties? Mississippi for Healthy Families or the people behind the Amendment?

Mississippi for Healthy Families was created by the people running Planned Parenthood and ACLU. They've basically tried to create MfHF as a separate entity because of the controversy over the other organizations.

As for the Amendment people it is likely the have religious ties. A lot of Pro-lifers are religious but not all.

I agree a life sentence is extreme. And I think I agree with most of what you said.

My niece Britt started puberty at 10. Mentally she was about 7 and that due to her mother's substance abuse while pregnant with her. But as her family we told her facts and that sex can lead to pregnancy and that we would prefer she wait until married. Granted that is doubtful in this day and age but I'll tell you one thing, Brittney does understand that having sex can lead to a baby - an idea that repulses her at this time, Thank GOD!

She also watched an old friend of her mother smoke her way through her pregnancy and told us on many occasions that she was harming her baby. We all knew it but the stupid woman made excuses.

Teenagers are taught in school sex education and drug education. They know it is harmful.

You see all these shows about teens saying they aren't ready for sex and they will wait despite pressure but I don't think that is the everyday reality. Girl often feel pressure to have sex and give in.

Boys are ridiculed because they are virgins. Why is being a virgin a bad thing? I'd rather be a person who hasn't found someone I'd be willing to have sex with than someone who has and has to deal with any ramifications of such a decision.

Edited at 2011-10-13 05:57 pm (UTC)
Mira -Blueberry Witch / human in Elf disguise..miravisu on October 14th, 2011 08:55 pm (UTC)
From what you wrote in your post I got the impression the amendment clearly said one thing and yet these Mississippi for Healthy Families folks said another.. so I was wondering what the reason was.

In the US, the ties between politics and religion can almost seem creepy, compared to how things are in Sweden for instance. Here we have but one political party that have a christian profile, but it's only in ideological stuff like whether homosexuals should adopt etc they actively voice their christian based beliefs.


Ack, poor Britt. She's had to grow up quickly, but for the most part for the better because it's nice to hear you've taken such a direct approach that's on her level. My daughter is 10 now. She's still playing with dolls. It's horrible to imagine children having own children alright!

My mother has smoked, and I'm never touching cigarettes (nor alcohol out of pure principle) after having seen with my own eyes the damage it does to the smoker and those around him/her. Pregnant women surely should know better nowadays!


*nodsnods*
That, and teen girls (and boys) having to care for baby dolls that they really have to take care off since they have simulated needs, seems to make teens realise a baby requires a lot of attention and responsability.

Incidentally, this reminds me of some egg thing from Buffy was it?


It is really frustrating when teens that should know better still manage to do harmful things. That in itself can be a cry for help though, they simply cannot handle life in another way. So true, not only information but some kind of safety net. Even if that court thing should have been the final resort somehow, preferably preeceed by some other preventive means. Of course, it's always easier to plan these things.. quite another to be a social services worker who face these situations.

It is weird double standards, when boys who are virgins are ridiculed, whereas girls who are not virgins are labelled sluts. I've read some interesting texts on the view on gender and sex. To some degree I think some do have a point with that males are considered to have their sexual organ added, like a bonus, and as an extension of them it seems to be accepted that it must be exercised. Spread "their wild oats" etc. Whereas females are their sexual organ/gender, since it's on the inside and female sexuality is somehow shrouded. Back in the day, some did think females had an inverted penis, crazy!

To some extent, I agree with waiting with sex. But what if you marry someone that feels right at the time, only to realise the sex is awful. I think practice does make perfect in some cases, but it's of course not everyone's cup of tea. iirc, Sweden has the highest number of single households in the world, and many simply do not marry here or at all before they have kids. My classmate from China seemed very surprised I was not married and had a child, in fact!


Eh yes, I ranted a bit off-topic there.. but just some of my thoughts a late Friday night :)
Jill aka Jo: Stock: Kitty Sleepingsireesanwar on October 14th, 2011 09:55 pm (UTC)
Well like anything like this one side or the other likes scare tactics. In this case, the more liberal want us to believe a woman who has a miscarriage will be tried for murder when in reality the only woman being investigated are those who ingested drugs or poison which resulted in the unborn babies death. In my opinion, not the definition of miscarriage.

I think most woman do know better now-a-days. Especially with all the tv. You see it constantly on television, woman saying they can't smoke or drink or take things because of the baby. It is only logical to assume that means meth and cocaine as well.

I'm really glad Brittney is being dealt with and that we've managed to make her understand just how horrible being a teen and a mother would be. But then she knows what it did to her mother.

I feel like people taking the less aggressive route is why we have the issues we have today. I mean I'm not saying you abandon your daughter because she gets pregnant and a young age but what is wrong with really trying to instill waiting for that person she is truly in love with or at least until she's an adult because I really don't think teens can deal with sex. Hell, sometimes I don't think I'm mature enough and I'm 32.

And you know, I wouldn't say you're horrible. And while I do believe in waiting until marriage I don't even mean that. Just because you start dating in your teens doesn't mean that you're first boyfriend should get to have sex with you. I'm thinking more like really thinking about the person and the situation before leaping in. Life would be easier on us if we slept with those we loved rather than anyone... I mean that itself is so risky.

Of course, with the waiting until after marriage, I would say just because they aren't great the first time around doesn't mean you two can't learn and grow together. I feel like if you're married to a person you should be able to say, hey let's try this or that. I mean I feel like there is more to marriage anyway. I mean I'd rather be married to the sweet funny guy who is always there for you and supports you through anything but isn't the greatest in bed than the guy that doesn't do anything to help and mooches off of you but is great in bed.

Just some thoughts.